While the battles in Iraq end, military pay and benefits may end up being the casualties of next years budget battles.
Tom Philpott’s latest Military Update offers a retrospective of the growth in pay and benefits over the last decade balanced against a warning that the current budget problems will likely end the benefits boom — record increases in military basic pay, the addition of TRICARE for Life, Concurrent Receipt, an increase in Servicemembers Group Life Insurance and the so-called Death Gratuity.
While the 2012 National Defense Authorization Act, which should be on the way to the President for signature, includes several provisions to ease the coming reduction in forces. The defense bill also includes a provision for increasing the TRICARE Prime enrollment fee each year at a rate equal to the retiree cost-of-living-adjustment percentage.
The following is a list of hoped for provisions that didn’t make it to the final cut of the 2012 defense bill:
- A provision that would have ended reductions in survivor benefit annuities for surviving spouses to match Dependency and Indemnity Compensation.
- A provision to ease the impact of this SBP-DIC offset by increasing amounts paid under the interim Special Survivor Indemnity Allowance.
- A lifting of the ban on concurrent receipt for all disabled retirees. This would have expanded CRDP to include disabled retirees with a service-connected disability of 40 percent or less. (CRDP currently only applies to those with 50 percent or greater ratings)
As Tom Philpott points out, “Beneficiaries have reason to be wary of the defense budget to be unveiled in February with all accounts, including personnel, facing spending cuts.”
Read the latest Military Update for more details on the drawdown tools and future benefit cuts.
Remember the point in time between the end of the Veitnam war and about 1980? During that period the Military was cut to the bone. History is starting to repeat itself now!
Hell yes. They called, we came. Now again we're being tossed aside and forgotten UNTIL they call once more. Makes me sick!!!!!
I was in the Navy 74 to 94 and I know the era well. Less than 300 ships in the Navy and deployments that lasted 10-12 months and turn around stateside 3-6 months. It was President Reagan increased military spending and the fleet grew to over 600 ships that things got better. When Clinton took office I decided it was time to retire quickly and I'm glad I did. I also remember the start of the "peace dividend" and the force closure of so many basis. Stuffing military into areas no designed for the influx.
I guarantee they will not be able to retain quality people in the services nor will recruiting goals be met.
Just more of the same.
I love how they've promised all "working age" retirees (except those of us on total disability including SSD) will be guaranteed a CUT in pension for every year until Retirement age.
Adding the increases in TRICARE to the annual increase in TRICARE Retiree Dental and the recent increases in prescription co-pays, retirees will see the dollar amount of their pension drop, and the purchasing power will be much less than that.
It gets better – they want to cut what Medicare pays by 27%. Medicare already pays too little for most doctors to even break even, so they are leaving Medicare in droves.
Tricare Prime pays 8% below Medicare -so our wonderful plan would pay 8% less than 27% less than not enough!?!?!? How did we get so lucky?????
SMS Vern….Once, not once do you hear of any of our wonderful lawmakers taking any kind of cut in pay and benefits. It just isn't right.
Vern Schroeder,
Congress hasn't had a payraise since 2009. It will be 3 years come 2012.
Nor have they taken any cuts, nor are they faced with any.
Yes htey have.
They passed and Automatic pay raise (above the CPI). If they do not vote NOT to take it, they get a raise every Oct 1
But since it is automatic, it never makes the news
Please go to the Congressional (Senate) web page, you can look up their income. They have not had a pay raise since 2009. If you go to law.cornell.edu, you can look up the public law they passed in 2009 freezing their pay.
They voted to freeze their pay at the same time they voted to freeze federal workers' pay. You can go both to the Senate website and look up their pay (and pay history), as well as to law.cornell.edu to look up the law.
So CharlesBryant is correct – their pay has been frozen since 2009.
Took me forever to get my disability & the Soc Sec judges are complete imbeciles. I’m in as much limbo of trying to stay alive & affording a living as the next guy. I can’t get a job (if there were good jobs at the present time to be had) due to a hazard of losing my present benefits & then a preponderance lack of benefits upon taking said job, if I were to do that. To say I’m tired of the Catch 22 our society has mastered is certainly putting it lightly.
My only solution would be to invoke huge belligerent penalties onto those in elected offices just like that of the UCMJ. A second set of standards upon which they must live. If we all had to live to a higher standard then so must they, but even more so. Even they (Government officials) look down their conceited noses at the military; then so be it. They can be executed or serve extended jail sentences for lesser charges of extortion or grand larceny due to the large number of people they affect. You folks get the idea.
This posturing & bravado on the public’s dime & causing the military (and others involved) to suffer for that which they have already payed for is enough already. Those elected officials are obviously not basing their decisions on anything of their own value. I.e., they have no interest or anything to lose. I say we give them beyond limbs, material worth & much more than a job to lose.
Where is all the money going to that we will save by being out of Iraq?
Into Obama's pocket so he can get the illegals vote and the welfare cases! Obama needs to be gone out of office in 2012.
Into more tax cuts for the wealthy? Amazing how one sided this forum is. The middle class is being slamed and all I hear is whining for my soicalized benefits.
Socialized? The veterans I know earned those benefits.
Sounds like you're a hater. He is president, get over it!!!
I want to know where all that money went as a result of BRAC!
AS THE SAYING GOES ''GOD AND THE SOLDIER WE ADORE IN TIME OF DANGER AND NOT BEFORE, DANGER GONE AND ALL THINGS RIGHTED, GOD IS FORGOTTEN AND THE SOLDIER SLIGHTED
JIM KILLETTE LTC USA RET
Still treating all of the Atomic Test troops like we did nothing. I was in operation Crossroads in 1946 and have yet to see a ribbon or any indication that they care.When most of us are gone to the other world then one of those great reps in DC might make a five minute talk about what brave young seamen we were. I will be 85 in Jan so I don't have much longer to listen to promises.
They should relabel the SBP -DIC offset the : "Dead Veterans Tax" as most taxes a named after the who is PAYING THE TAX. The veteran paid for SBP. He should not be taxed because of the way he died.
Whatever it is called, the injustice to military surviving spouses continues. Members of Congress support the legislation to eliminate the SBP/DIC offset for unremarried military spouses (the only ones who experience this offset), but it is always dropped in the conference committee. Somehow money is found to fund other projects, but never for military widows and widowers. For some widows and widowers, their DIC totally offsets their SBP. It is the principle that must be recognized. The "Dead Veterans" paid premiums for 30 years during their retirement. Because they died as disabled veterans, their spouses are denied benefits. This must be corrected.
I threatened to divorce my wife upon retirement, as they wanted us in separate rooms to push for the SBP program(the biggest ripoff) They told her all the good points, leaving out that it would take half my retirement and she'd only get half of that back, minus social security. A term life policy for $250,000 would do better and cost less.
http://www.retirees.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.a…
You stupid SOB's you cut the military benefits on our troops now, with the possibility of troop reduction where the hell are you going to be when you need more troops in the next crises you stick your nose in. There will be no incentive to join.
Then they raise the incentives. Never thought of that. And the recruits will coming running. Always works. That and there are always some who want the adventure. And later these motives turn into wanting a pension plan they can't get in our shrinking middle class civilian jobs.
Politicans love us when the military is needed to get the job done and when they're running for re-election. Other then that, you're low lying fruit, easily cut and discarded.
I don't vote for democratd at the National or State Levels, they just support the illegals,,welfare forlks and are anti-gun supporters. At the local level most of the democrats are the same way. It is a sad, bunch of brain washed ding-a-lings.
sgt bill retired should tale a few minute s and take a look of this country s history and which party was in office when the country was prosprperous and not att war or meddling in others country s . the republican s have always been condition, they s determental to U S A they start shit and then stand back and critize the democratsattempt to reverse the damage the republicans caused
Sgt Bill wants to whine out of one side of his mouth that he's not getting enough Federal benefits and socialized health care and then out of the other side of his mount whine that no one should get those government give aways and Obama Care. That's not patriotism that is BS.
This article cracks me up by stating "Tom Philpott’s latest Military Update offers a retrospective of the growth in pay and benefits over the last decade balanced against a warning that given the current budget problems will likely end the benefits boom — record increases in military basic pay, the addition of TRICARE for Life, Concurrent Receipt, an increase in Servicemembers Group Life Insurance and the so-called Death Gratuity." This article fails to say how far behinde the private sector they let us get before the increases. Lets not forget, we had soldiers on food stamps a couple of years ago; while Washington lawmakers live high and mighty in thier multi-million dollar mansions. As far as the insurance – - – They pormised it to us when we raised our right hands to protect this country!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
CMorris,
People in the military that are drawing foodstamps is their own fault. Ask yourself just how does someone not make enough to support their famility?
You obviously weren't in the military, and if you were, it was not in the mid to late 70's.
EMCM(SS) Ret.,
Yes, in the Military from:
1969 – 1972 Active
1972 – 1975 Enactive Reserves
1976 – 1995 Active
My point, is how does someone in the Military get on foodstamps?
Those who serve in the military today make well. True in the pst soldiers did not do as well but ladies and gentlemen we r looking at the present time and future. I do not think it is a good time to cut the military and I would not be surprised if they build the guard up because it is less to maintain. I do believe that with less involvement overseas it will save the country a substantial amt. If congress wnts to cut anyones pay they should lead by example.
I guess you've had your head in the sand for a long time. I worked two jobs to make ends meet, In 1980 I was paying $1,000 plus for a house in Colorado as an E6. If I remember right, my take home pay was about a whooping $750 every two weeks. If you were in the military, you must have been an officer and making all kinds of extras. In 2011 the BX is still geared towards officers. I won't shop there except for a few odds and ends.
Hear, hear. My family was on food stamps when I was an E-5!
EMCM(SS) Ret.,
Why did you get foodstamps?
Amen folks. I was in the USN from 1971 to 1992. I did one stint of shore duty in recruiting from 79 to 81. Recruiting was dying on the vine. The many of the only people interested were criminals and dope fiends.
This is so typical. Placate with a rinky dink pay raise that doesn't make up for the COLA we lost over the past few years, then knife us in the back. So typical.
Add to that the loss of retirement income due to behind the scenes tax increases.
I am told by the VA providers (who are excellent by the way) that I must test twice a day for my diabetes. However, the pharmacy is limited as to how many test strips they can send me. Somehow I am expected to make one month worth of testing supplies last three. Cool, huh?
I was Med. retired from the Navy in 64, I had Diabetes. I ware a infusion pump all my care is done threw the VA. My VA treatment is great. Except last month I had a issue were I needed medical attention for a a infection from a Damn cat bite It was on a Saturday and the closest VA hospital is 95 miles away. So I called the VA and they told me to go to the closest hospital for treatment. I did. Guess what now the VA is refusing to pay the 1,000. bucks. Their reasoning is because I did not go when I originally was bitten. I do have a emergency treatment card. In the old days they would have paid for treatment
That's OK, you can live with the comfortable though that you are not supporting socialized medice, you know Obama Care. You know if we let anyone have reasonably priced health insurance this country will be in serious trouble.
You can get enough test strips if your provider provides clinical information for the reason for twice a day testing. The VA Drug Formulary has guidelines as to what qualifies for extra testing supplies. Talk to your VA provider.
Thanks for your reply VARX. I've already spoken to the head honcho for the VA hospital I am assigned to about the testing supplies. If anyone should be able to solve this issue, she should. She has already told me that chances are I will be frozen at the number of strips I currently get. If the pharmacy won't listen to her, then I am on my own.
One can easily get their skivvies worked up their crack when looking at figures. I talked to a retired CPO back in '95; the guy was making nearly 28K as a 26yr man. Seemed very high; he retired in the early 70's and said the COLA's had been very nice. Fast fwd to 2011; low colas since I retied in '01, coupled with nice pay raises on the active side has seen my annual SCPO retirement dip more than 3K less than what a CPO with the same number years retiring now; and nearly 9K less than an SCPO that retires now with 22.I studied this a few years back, the spread actually gets worse looking back thru the 90's; was stable in the 80's, and benefited retirees prior to that. This no longer bothers me to any great degree.
It should not be a surprise at all. What is the Army going to do with all the troops in Garrison? We all knew that the increase in troops was temporary. Expenses you will face when you finally retire: Life Insurance, TRICARE ( it will cost you but you can choose your plan), Dental( depending on how dependents) it just went up and of course SBP. Do your homework and plan, future retire.
Manuel,
Bingo. Never seen so many whining and crying about the job they chose to do.
Was thinking the same time, why do so many vets have to whine so damn much. Sure, I get mad too, but this whining seems like a life style to these vets.
It's called a contractual agreement. We agreed to risk life and limb — and health — in return for pay and ancillary benefits. Ever since the mid-'70s, Congress has shown it feels no obligation to adhere to that contract.
Care to pull out your enlistment contract and see what it says? I have mine – it has NO guarantees of income after service, not even retirement pay.
Do you have your enlistment contract? I have mine. Don't see anything in there about retirement benefits. And it states it's the "sole contract" between me and the US government, overriding any promises made to me by the recruiter, either orally or in writing.
BTW – you do know that you can still get free health care (Space A) in military treatment facilities? You do know that the COLA is based on a 1970's law – and it includes provisions that prevent COLA from being negative?
retiree,
LMAO, I rarely see anyone on the message boards lately that know what they are talking about. Keep up the good work.
Bill Tuttle,
Have you actually read you contractual agreement DD Form 4?
Congress can talk about this when they take an equal cut in benefits. Until then they can all go to hell.
EMCM(SS) Ret,
What the hell does what Congress get paided have to do with Military Retirement? Nothing.
You might check out the congressional retirement program.
FERS – they get 1.7%/year accrual, payable at age 62. If they serve 20 years, they can retire at age 50. Note that after 20 years their retired pay is 34% of their base pay for the top 3 years, not 50%.
Oh, and they pay into it to boot, as well as paying cash for their health care (and considerably more than $520/year).
So what's your point?
And their base pay is buttloads more than what an officer in the military makes while he is dodging bullets and IED's.
EMCM(SS) Ret,
True, but like those in the Military, no one twisted anyones arms to join the service or run for Congress.
As long as I've been alive, there has always been someone that makes more than I do. I chose my career and they chose theirs.
And those illegally in this country and the never ending thousands more violating our laws, borders and sovereignty every week are rewarded with amnesty, work permits, free healthcare, welfare and other taxpayer benefits….Go figure.
What does this ave to do with Military Retirement?? Nothing!!
Let me be frank here, those serving today both enlisted and officer make well. If the military did not get any pay raises for the next three years I do not think it will affect them. Those in the civilian sectors r hurting much more. What ever happened to true patriotism?all I hear now is who is to blame, congress,illegals, the military, our president etc. Truth is we r all to blame. Greed has gottn to all of us. Note. I serverd both enlisted and officer and I am a federal worker in the civilian world
If you do a true analysis of enlisted pay per hour they have never been paid there true market value so saying they are well paid is false. I made less then 20 K for ten years and barely over 30 K the rest of my career. This cut will amount to office supplies the real budget is in medicare and SSN. If we are all going to pay our fare share lets starts with the 50% who don't pay taxes
Finally, someone who has got it right. Damn illegals are what is killing this country the most, second is everything is made in China…….God please help us.
The way "they" treat we vets, why would todays youth even WANT to be in the military? Wonder what the upcoming election would look like if only Vets voted? When was the last time the Powers To Be took a pay or benefits cut?..VietNam Vet 67-68
1st Cav/VN,
Congress hasn't had a pay raise since 2009, and won't get one in 2012 either.
Thanks for that fact. Seriously.
Stewart,
Another thing you may have forgotten, is that Federal Works have also been under a pay freeze for 2 years, and this may be extended for another year.
http://www.federalnewsradio.com/?nid=178&sid=…
The alternative to "wanting to be in" is a draft. Surely you don't want to serve with draftees, especially during peacetime. Things could have been better in Nam. My answer would be 'not to be so damn war like'.
I just read this article and I don't like what I read. Our officials have let us down.or they will.They need the military when they get in trouble and need someone to fix their bungling and when it is fixed they try their best to get rid of the military.So that they can pocket the money that would be spent on our defense.and benefits for those military personel who survived their Cannon fodder .Did you know that our Congressmen and Congresswomwn and Representatives Ratings are below zero right now cause nobody trusts them.
Do you think they really care. As long as we just talk about it and do nothing it will always continue. What we need and most of you are afraid to do is march on Washington DC like every other group that feels they have been wronged right or not and demand what is ours. Think about it.
When Carter was voted out of office and Reagan took over the military received a very nice increase for the first time in 4 years. When your current commander is voted out of office we can start making up for his 4 years of blunders. We just have to make sure its not someone like McCain who is at the front of the line trying to take things away from the military. Fun how the naval grads kind of think along the same lines..must be the teachers?
I can't believe I was silly enough to entrust my government and it's people to keep their promise.
Sure Reagan gave a nice boost to the budget, but one place he wanted to pay for it was out of the Veterans! It was the worse of times for Vietnam vets, we were all having our disability compensation decreased. I took a huge fall. Never had any of that problem with Dems.
@Charles Bryant:
Congress wields control over our paychecks and our benefits. We have cuts hanging over our heads. So much talk about everyone having to sacrifice. They can set the example by taking cuts to their benefits. THAT is what the issue is. Do you see them taking any cuts? NO. Do you see their retirement and benefits being threatened? NO.
They don't have to risk life and limb and watch their buddies die to get a pension, hell they don't even have to serve anywhere near twenty years.
That is the issue my friend. So much talk by politicians about "shared" sacrifice. Until I see them sacrifice themselves, they can shut their pie holes and go to hell.
Read about how are friends in congress are rich and getting richer
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/27/us/politics/eco…
EMCM(SS) Ret.,
Guess we aren't see things the same. For me, I don't see any cuts at all hanging over my head. Matter of fact since I have been retired (1995) my retirement pay has only gone up.
You talk about taking a cuts to their benefits, because somewhere you see cuts to your benefits. What benefit cuts are you talking about? The difference here, is that federal workers/Congressmen unlike us (Military Retirees) pay into their Retirement and their Health Care Packages.
You might have an argument here if we both paid into our Retirement and HealthCare Packages. And, as I have mentioned, yes, they have taken cuts, in that they haven't had a pay raise since 2009 and won't get one in 2012, and Federal Workers have had their pay frozen for the last 2 years.
Apparently we don't read things in the same way. Hiking Tricare? Offsetting? Maybe we've read different articles.
Instead of frozen COLA my pay has gone DOWN since the last COLA. Why? Because the amount of my withholding has gone UP without my every changing my withholding myself. With this so called "pay raise" I will still not be back up to the income I had before the freeze on COLA a few years ago.
I DO have to pay CO-PAY to the VA. Once my wife is in-country and will have to pay higher premiums when I put us both on Tri-care. Being diagnosed by a VA provider with PTSD, I won't even start to talk about trying to get a disability approval from the Board.
I am proud as hell of my service, and that of all my other brothers and sisters that have served. I am sorry, but being a Viet Nam era vet, I can see the handwriting on the wall
EMCM(SS) Ret.,
I guess we aren't reading the same thing. I've not seen or read anything that says my benefits are going to be taken away. Looking at my most resent depost my December pay went up $68.39 and according to my RETIREE ACCOUNT STATEMENT if will go up an additional $3.96 per month starting in Feb.
EMCM(SS)Ret. I don't have a clue where you're stateing you'll get an increase on Feb.1st. Increases are effective Dec. 1st. and appear in your Jan. pay. and it's been like that for years.
WJP,
Go to https://mypay.dfas.mil/mypay.aspx.
Log In.
Click on "I agree to the terms of the user agreement".
Click on "Annual Change to RAS".
At this time you should see a more up to date Retiree Account Statement that shows "NEW PAY DUE AS OF Feb 01, 2012".
We need to take away their ability to vote in their own raises & benefits. Obviously someone has to decide on their pay but it shouldn't be them. Out of the 3 arms of government, it would seem it could only go to the president. Maybe then they'd cooperate better….
I get very frustrated at the negative comments I read about our lawmakers in DC. I do want to make sure I'm understood. My frustration is NOT, and I repeat NOT because of the comments themselves because believe me, I definitely agree with all of them. My frustration comes from the fact we vets never receive any replies worth hearing or reading. A while back, I did receive what I consider a "mass produced, rubber stamp" letter from one congressman stating his "concern", but no mention of his willingness to cut his benifits. I would like to find just ONE of those clown loaches who has the guts to stand up and say, "I agree and I'm willing to give up some of my benefits and priveleges." Trust me fellow vets, I AIN'T holding my breath!
Blood, life and limb is not enough to give, now our government require the food on our table and family lives as well. When does it stop. It scene with our government, cuts always seem to start at the bottom and never reaches the TOP. What great I deal, bring our military home, kick them out, cut their benefits and say, we helping the economy, big word for those living large in Washington. God has His eyes on YOU Washington!
LTC Jake We need to continue to put pressure on all our legislators and people in office to lead by example and walk the talk. Before they ever cut a cent from any Military pay or promised benefits they shoul cut make an example by cutting their benefits and pay and health insurance and gauranteed retirement after minimum terms in office. VOTE Them all out. We, as Veterans organizations, need to assemble and march on Washington to declare our anger at their cutting and minipulating our promised benefits and pay increases.
This would be a great idea, If it could could actually work… Other than the camps of the Veterans of WW1 & the resulting outrage of their disbursement, nothing or no one is taken seriously unless a resulting truthful wrong has been pointed out & then grossly prosecuted. We’ve basically become a society of 180 degree causality. Not 100%, but with the bipartisan bickering you get the idea.
LTC,
I keep seeing this deflection to Legislators and those in office to lead by example and walk the talk and must say, they have done this, but no one seems to remember just what has been done.
1. A pay freeze is in place for Federal workers.
2. Congressmen haven't had a payraise since 2009.
3. The Federal Work force was cut.
Amen to that brother, they treat us right as long as there's a war, then cut everything but their own, never ending spending on getting re-elected. They ALL need to go and get real jobs and see what the real world is like.
Robert,
Just what is it "THEY" are cutting?
What do you consider a real job?
Sorry. I'm too annoyed and angry to write any thing nice @ the moment…sign me P…….D off!
Reconman.. I totally agree with LTC JAKE.. all REPEAT all vETERANS UNITS should march on Washington, DC and let our ,nation know our plight.
It has been mentioned in another letter that blood, limbs and other disabilities is not enough. Well, what is? Why can these elected officials reap so much of our nations benefits? Why? Cause they voted it for themselves. Obama ran on a ticket for change. Well its about time isnt it!
LTC IS RIGHT CUT ALL POLITICANS PAY AND BENEFITS ALSO NO RETIREMENT PENSION AFTER DOING MEASLEY 4 YRS ALSO FAMILY REAPS BENEFITS FOR MEDICAL MAYBE VETERANS SHOULD PROTEST AND MARCH WE RAISED OUR HANDS SWORE DEFEND COUNTRY AND RISK THEIR LIVES COUNTLESS YRS THIS IS THANKS AND GRATITUDE WE GET THEY ALL SHOULD BE VOTED OUT OFFICE EITHER THEY FOR US OR AGANIST US PERIOD!
RETIREDNAVY,
"LTC IS RIGHT CUT ALL POLITICANS PAY AND BENEFITS ALSO NO RETIREMENT PENSION AFTER DOING MEASLEY 4 YRs."
Under both CSRS and FERS, Members of Congress are eligible for a pension at the age of 62 if they have completed at least five years of service.
http://www.senate.gov/CRSReports/crs-publish.cfm?…
A one million vet march on DC and a stand down by the gov. is what vets need to get organized and stand up for our rights, or most of us will die from chemicals, vaccinations and BS the military puts on soldiers. Vietnam vet, I know I been through the shit and back. You think war is hell, wait till deal with the DVA.
Served '79-2001,,,married with 1 child as E-5, 2 as E6, and 3rd as E7; never relied on handouts fron Navy relief, relatives or foodstamps. Facts: The '01-'10 pay raise has averaged exactly 4%; that's .6% more than the average raise from '83 thru '00. That does not sound like much, but that adds up to an 11% improvement in pay in the last 10 years compared to the 18 years prior to that. No sour grapes directed to current active duty members, I'm happy they are being paid decently.
I retired in '81' with 23 yrs. as a Senior NCO because Carter, who laid the ground work for "Everyone should get a home loan regardless of ability to pay for the guaranteed Government loan.", gutted the military budget and promoted EEO and lax disipline. We had to scronge for everything to keep'em flying in the AF. I just got tired of having to fight my Government and foreign enemies too. Now I just fight my Government who took 8 years, 2 chemo's & a bone marrow transplant for non-hodgekins to recognize I was exposed to agent orange eventho I provided evidence of "Boots on the ground". Things haven't changed.
I just remember "If you can read & write thank a teacher." If you can freely do it in english, thank a veteran." A group of birds is a flock, a group of cows is a herd, and a group of baboons is called a CONGRESS – check it out!
Poor banking industry. Mean old government invents and passes a bill that "forces" banks to open their markets to more people, earn more profits and business, and have all their risks comfortably socialized by that same mean old government. Coincidentally, all lobbyists were hands off of that one. Not like they pressured and wrote the legislation for congress to pass…not like the same bill wasn't revisited and completely redrawn under every single additional president since carter to the tune of greater than 10 revisions.
Welcome, my friends! …to Fantasy Island!
Kipling wrote long ago:
For it’s Tommy this, an’ Tommy that, an’ “Chuck him out, the brute!”
But it’s “Saviour of ‘is country” when the guns begin to shoot;
An’ it’s Tommy this, an’ Tommy that, an’ anything you please;
An’ Tommy ain’t a bloomin’ fool — you bet that Tommy sees!
Thanks for recruiting Chief and supporting those kids that needed direction during this timeframe. I have been Navy enlisted, Army emlisted and CWO, USAF and USPHS officer because you gave me a chance to draw me away from the BS in the late 70's. Still active duty for a minute or two. Chief Hughes was my recruiter. Good guy as you are.
the benifits we now have is because the vets stuck together,on the democrats side, you people just talk no action, like the rep do . all for the rich, to hell with the middle class and lower, when you wise up and stick together , then things will happen , talk is bs
LTC,
Here is a real positive approach to our congressmen & women:
Cut their wages in half (they make over 100K/speech/unlimited times/year), cut all benefits (they need to lead by example) cut their wages, no retirement, no insurance and no more insider trading). Why are we letting these 555 congressional BULLIES roll us over. We give it our all and now they take it all. This is bullsh_t.
I concur…thx
LTC
I served in the USMC from 1969-1975. The pay of an E-1 now is equal to the 1969 pay of a 2 star. I was paid a total of $27,000 in salary for my 6 years
of active duty, the last 3 years as an E-5. My GI bill was $271.00/month while in class. The war is over, cuts are comming, the country is broke. I left the Marine Corp ( After 2 tours in Viet-Nam) because I wanted to provide my family with a better life. If you are unhappy with your pay and benifits do as I did, move on. You will not find a job out here that retires you at age 48. Many jobs in the private sector have a risk of injury or death attatched to it. If you want to lobby for pay and benifits, I say more power to you, go for it…Just please stop whinning, it embarrases this old Marine.
Agree with your distaste for whining, and my first paychecks were $105/2 wks during Vietnam. However, might consider this: The “war” is not over. Don’t buy into the Dem Big Lie intended to make the military sacrifice for liberal social programs. USA has more threat to security than ever before. A China poised to exert it’s military influence throughout the world. (Already sewing up rare earth and petroleum supplies.) An Iran who this morning announced its intent to block oil supplies thru Straits of Hormuz, even as it’s navy conducts war exercises. Who knows what the nuclear-capable N. Korea will do next. And Russia under Putin re-asserting it’s power on the world stage. Those job you assert have risk … also pay much, much more than comparable military skills/experience levels. Just check out pay/benefits for police, fire, rescue, etc. See what a contractor is paid in risk areas for doing essentially the same work as our soldiers. Finally, the military has changed since you were in. Even Marines (and I have greatest respect for Marines) must possess much greater smarts and training to conduct the USA’s high tech, highly successful brand of warfare. Everyone is rotating into harm’s way continually — more time in a conflict zone than home with the family. And the Guard are totally over utilized beyond their charter. Finally, junior enlisted grades still make less that a fast foods hamburger flipper.
I respect your words…My point is that the USA is broke, we are borrowing 41% of the money we spend. I was in China earlier this year on a government mission and was able to spend some time interacting with the locals.. They are moving toward a market economy at about the same speed as we are moving towards socialism…and bankruptcy. We are forced to cut spending, and the military is a major expense. We are being forced to cut pay and benifits to save oue economy, I didn't say I thought this was a great thing. My advice was if you are in the military and are not prepared to see take-aways, move on. The civilian employees of the government are looking at a 5 year pay freeze ( Two years already frozen and 3 to go) wilth a proposed 20% cut in retirement. The average retirement after 30 years service is $1,056 per month….Also remember, the GAO stated this January that government pay is on average 25% less than the private sector. Other people have suffered, the military will not excape its share of pain.
the shit is that our "broke" government wants to spend money on every social program around — show me in the Constitution where our government must pay for welfare and hundreds of similar programs. Ain't there Joe! But it does say that the Fed government first priority is security of the country and that is what the military is for. I am glad you left after your second enlistment since is obvious you were not a career soldier/marine. Yes there are jobs such as the police who are in harms way in much the same ways as "the military," but they are on home turf, whereas the military is sent out of the neighborhood to protect the neighborhood. I spent 21 of my 26 year career out of the US, whereas one of my nephews was a prison guard and retired with at 40 with less time "in service", a larger pension and medical care, than the average service member. Is stayed on active service because I enjoyed the work, expected reasonable retirement an health care. I have that now — but all I hear is cut the military (at a time when a strong military is probably needed most), cut benefit (all earned by time served) but don't cut welfare, unemployment benefits beyond two years, and other social programs that in many cases are not earned. So don't call those serving and those who have and are receiving the rewards earned as whinners. The beginner's are the "occupy whatever" people who want everything free nd not earned and our representatives in government who give it to them. With what I see in the world, as I travel, I pity our leaders when they again need a strong military to defend this nation — most of us who give our lives who service to the nation voluntarily will be too old to be recalled. And until I see strong support for the military by our leaders I will continue to recommend that our young people not to enlist but to consider vocational school, junior college or regular college. Then I help them find the money to attend. We love our country but not the leadership who SHIT on their "non-union" employees and former employees.
Mark Wynn,
"Finally, junior enlisted grades still make less that a fast foods hamburger flipper."
This is totally false.
You are correct … sort of. Pay scale for an E-1 over 4 months and a McDonald’s full service food worker show the E-1 makes about $17. 500 and the McDonald’s hamburger flipper makes about $15,500. So, how does the E-1′s pay possible reflect her/his duties and responsibilities, as compared to a hamburger flipper?
Mark,
About 2 years ago (2009) I figured this out and based it on 2 guys without a high school education. One joins the service and the other goes to work for minumum wage.
The soldier, after paying Federal Income Tax, Social Security and Medicare Tax, living the barracks and eating in the mess hall, he clears $1.121.56.
My figures for the civilian after paying his bills ended up him owing money.
This is just bare bones figures having nothing to do with comparing jobs. I figured nether one of them had the arm twisted ot join or not to join.
For CharlesBryant … thanks for the comparison between high school dropout who joined the military and one who went to work for minimum wage. I agree an enlistment or two brings a lot of training and “burnishing” for a young person while paying at least a living wage. However, I wasn’t aware that the services are recruiting high school dropouts. At least, they weren’t when I was active a decade ago. And I believe the Air Force has required high school diploma since the 60s.
Mark Wynn,
To the best of my knowledge, the army has always been able to enlist a very small number of Catigory IV personell. These percentages come from Congress. I only used the high school drop out because back in the day I was one. Whether I used high school graduates or not, doesn't change the the numbers.
Ever heard of inflation? You are comparing salaries of over forty years ago to today. That is like comparing apples to oranges. How much did a home, car, or groceries cost back in the sixties and seventies while you were in. The only one whinning is you. Sounds like you are jealous because you didn't stay in for a career and benefits. 1986-2008 Four tours in the desert with countless other deployments. CW3, USA, RET
You must be a moron to compare your vietnam era pay to today's pay. Sir you ever heard of inflation? I love when old fogies compare caveman days to today. Open up your mind sir, Please.
Believe me, the pay in 1969 had much less buying power than the present pay despite inflation. And please, don't resort to name-calling because you disagree with me. I served honorably for 6 years in the USMC, was wounded twice in combat and was able to leave the military and compete very well in the private sector. At 61 years old I could probably still kick your ass….If you don't like my analysis of the political issues of today stick around and see if I am right…. I will repeat the message, If you can't tolerate monatary and benifit reductions prepare yourself for a return to the private sector. Good luck Matt…
Elmo,
I apprceate your service however, you need to take a business 101 class back in 1969 gas was 29 cents a gallon compaired to the $ $3.40 today. The military pay of today is based on the current cost of living and inflation not 1969. As for retire at 48 in the private sector name me a job in the private sector that does't pay you for overtime…not in the military…what pivate secotor job requires you to be away from your family for long periods of time…and by the way only about 17% of the military actualy stays in until 20 + years…but if congress has it way and pushes the retirment to age 60 before you can collect your retirment that number will drop to singal digits. Then what happens to all your senior leadership? So stop whinning and support your brothers in arms.. Proud to have served 28 years retired E-8 USAF
Excellent points, Senior … and there are other profound differences, such as accepting limitations on citizen rights and freedoms (once one makes the ultimate choice and takes the oath), UCMJ, etc.
I second this.
Your point about inflation is true, things do cost more now than in 1969. I was in the Marine Corp when it transitioned from V.N. to a garrison model, and I can tell you changes are comming. I was not whinning about my decisions, I served the Corp with honor, spent three years out-of-country out of my six years, and left because I wanted to actually see my kids grow up and to be able to provide for them. I was giving you the benifit of some knowledge that I am in the unique position to posess. I did not say in my original note that I thought cutting Military pay and Benifits was a good idea, I just stated it was going to happen. Each person has to decide for themselves what life they choose. I repeat, If you are not able to adjust to a post-war military you should consider your options. Life is too short to work an occupation with anger and regret. I loved my time in the Corp, and do not regret leaving. I appreciate all of your sacrifices and wish you all the best.
I hate those "private sector jobs" that carry some risk of injury or death! That's just what I was thinking in 1971, when I was flying T.O. and 90 knots per hour, a foot over jungle tree tops, while dodging .51 cals! Boy, I wanna tell YOU! I was thrilled to have that safe, cushy job, rather than working one of those dangerous private sector jobs!
Stop whimpering, its time to march on Washington lady's!
What we need is more vets running for open seats in congress and senate. then we as vets can make changes to help the ones that served before and the new ones serving. Then we can control this V.A. system that pats itself on the back with bounses and gratiuties We could also strighten this system out that was there to serve us and not us serves them. Marine vet 73-80
We went from fighting a foreign enemy to fighting Washington – what a shame.
It is incredible that now that they have used us to fight wars on many fronts that they would cut our pay and benefits. We earned those benefits with blood , sweat and tears. Thanks for nothing Congress.
Francisco,
I was never used, I joined the service and continued to reenlist until I retired. Draft ended in 1973.
E6-Vietnam Vet-Totally agree with LTC_Cut all congressional pay in half.,or min of 30%.,and don't stop there.,The President's retirement pay can be cut to save also.,and his pay.,after all in Oct.,2011.,he said that all should sacrifice so that too many won't suffer when he announced the Tricare(TFL) additional costs per year to retirees! 12/28/11
my son went to iraq and saw many horrors which left him with flash backs and post tramatic stress syndrome i mean bad off his back is out of whack his wrist pops out of place he has been trying to get help to no avail he was a gunner on one of those big guns he needs help badly if the va would get off their hands these men would not have to suffer for so long without help i am a mad mother
With respect to all of the men and women that have done the right thing and answered their country's call, I thank you for your service and sacrifices. I am a Vietnam Vet (67-68) and this whole thing stinks from high hell. You must understand that EVERYTHING IS ABOUT MONEY, especially when it comes to government and the professional politicians. These people are bought and sold to the highest bidders and it is just a pure fact and as long as we don't correct the corruption in Washington, DC nothing will matter. All, let me repeat, ALL concerns and doing the right thing went out the window a long time ago. Stop kidding yourself and keep in mind what was said a long time ago by a very wise man, 'WE HAVE THE BEST GOVERNMENT THAT MONEY CAN BUY', end of discussion.
I"m not a politician, but have served my country well.Most of all I never believed politician were ever in favor of the people they serve only when they wanted to get elected after that it"s one for one and no one else.Save money by cutting down their benefits let them work 30 tg 40 years before they can retire and then collect, why pay them for the rest of their life when only serving a few years.
I'll run if I can get the support, we should have more of the small people in congress or senate that are for the people not for one. Maybe another revolution is needed to get us back on track.
Totally agree. Is there any way to start a petition to take away their ability to vote for their own raises & benefits?
Read Article V of the Constitution – it describes how to amend it.
Why they set their own salaries – because they pass the laws.
US Constitution, Article I, Section 6, Clause 1: The Senators and Representatives shall receive a Compensation for their Services, to be ascertained by Law, and paid out of the Treasury of the United States.
This is modified by the XXVII Amendment:
No law, varying the compensation for the services of the Senators and Representatives, shall take effect, until an election of Representatives shall have intervened.
If Congress decides to make changes to military retirement pay it should only apply to people who choose to join in the future. The majority of US citizens understand the financial crisis that our nation is in and how important it is that we find solutions to our deficit spending. The Department of Defense can and should be more efficient and spend tax payer dollars very judiciously. However, as a Soldier who has been on active duty for 14 years and as a veteran who has spent a total of 26 months in Iraq I would feel as though Congress is breaking faith with the current force if they decide to reduce or delay retirement benefits.
Today’s force has been at war since 11 SEP 01 and many of us stayed in the military while enduring multiple deployments, the hardships of combat, as well as missing many birthdays, anniversaries, and holidays. While these difficulties are the price that Soldiers pay for being part of the Profession of Arms Congress has an obligation to keep their promise to the current force and to honor their contract with today’s Soldiers to provide them with the benefits that they were promised when the joined the Army.
I see all of the Right Wing Tea Baggers are posting without the first bit of research, check out the latest pay and benefits being posted in articles on Military.Com. I made $76.00 per month when I went and when I got married that was another $65.00 month and seperate rations was $36.00 per month.Everything cost much less back then. Now days housing allowance is more per month than I made all year but we all served with pride and didn't bitch about everything that didn't go our way. This Tea Bagger movement has produced a less than stellar group of vets, sometimes I feel sorry for their warpped minds that can't see beyound a preverted view of America. They loke to play the blame game but only against the other side as their side is always perfect. Well your side got several thousand troops killed and tens of thousands crippled for life for a war that should have never been. Lay the blame on whomever the guilty party is.
old vet
hear hear….
What is with you ostriches that seems to believe the tea party movement is to blame for all of Obama’s miss-fires?? The only tea bags I’m familiar with go in my tea cup. Nobody else here is talking tea bags except you.
Mark Wynn you have your head in a very dark deep hole and if you had a brain you would see the carnage caused by your Tea Baggers friends to our Country. You want to blame Obama for all the things gone wrong, but you don't list one thing to back up your claim. Not being an Obama supporter myself I do know that the Dow Jones has gone up over 35% in the less than three years in office, but if you go back 5 years to include the last 2 years of Bush there is a negative over 2.5% it takes time to repair all of the damage "W" and his band of Crooks caused and now this last year the Tea Baggers are trying to make the damage "W" did to the country look like child play. Mark you and your Tea Bagger movement is finally starting to get the credit for all of your damage you're doing to our country.
WJP, hopefully you are long gone out of our Armed Forces and located somewhere where you cannot do too much damage to our country with your interesting thinking. Please do keep making your fascinating comments on blogs like this one … the rest of us will be in the trenches, involved in the democratic process.
I repeat, never been associated with any tea party movement. WJP, your personal agenda is messing with your mind. And you statements are so far from the facts that it would take too long to dissect them. Therefore, Adios and have a good day.
I pull the warriors bodies off aircraft when the come home…..i see their torn bodies…. they earned the right to complain.
Shirley, have your son go to an American Legion Post or a Disabled American Veteran office branch and they will help him with filing for VA disability benefits. There is a tremendous backlog on claims at the Regional Offices due to the ending of OIF. The VA needs to hire more claim processors to speed up the adjudication process. In the meantime, our boys need interim medical benefits. Go see your congressman/senator and they will get answers for you. Good Luck.
sgt,
Congressmen don't get paid the rest of there life for only serving a few years.
http://www.factcheck.org/2007/12/congressional-pe…
… and neither do members of the Armed Forces. So, what’s your point?
Mark Wynn,
HUH.
Sgt said:
"why pay them for the rest of their life when only serving a few years."
CB pointed out we don't. They pay into their retirement fund and SS, and must serve a minimum of 5 years to get a pension (which they get at age 62 at that). CB even pointed to a source for the answer. Another source: http://www.senate.gov/reference/resources/pdf/RL3…
Wall Street (Goldman( just sold litton to Ocwen who screwed up my mortgage (non va). Ocwen is in India. enough said. My mortgage went from $560.00 per month and increases in a nanosecond to $1688. Ocwen (research) does not know why. What a crock. How many more vets has this happened to along with the ones foreclosed on?
connie,
Surely you must know why your mortgage went up!. If my rent/morgage went up that much, I sure would know why.
Most doctors wil not accept Tricare, well exactly none. Health care what a joke. Just give me the money so I can pay cash to the doctor. Doctors if they do get paid, get paid less than the cost of a full servoice oil change. Politicans need to tell the truth for a change.
connie,
Just stop paying your Tricare premiums and you will then have your monies in hand to pay cash. Let me know how that works out for ya.
Rick, I don’t appreciate your racist remarks on this military blog that is discussing important issues. If you need VA assistance with any personal issues, let me know and I’ll find you a phone number. I trust a Military.Com will remove your blog ASAP. Feel free to resubmit a blog about your disability pay issues … but please leave out the hate BS.
On reading your BS a second time, never mind. I’m confident you are some college kids who never served in the military and wrote your “over the top” paragraph in order to embarrass and mess with service members and veterans. Time to get back to your dorm room, kiddies.
You are a hopeless fail on ALL counts! You are'nt confident about ANYTHING, fool! What you ARE, is pissed off at people who tell the truth because you can't tolerate the truth if it involves a belief set not identical to YOURS! I believe in privacy, so I don't give my last name. But everyone who has read my posts knows that my military and combat knowledge is way too detailed and precise for me to be lying about my combat service in Vietnam! I was with the 176th and 116th AHC's at Chu Lai, and attached to the 101st Airborne Screaming Eagles at Phu Bai. Satisfied, or should I continue? Shame on a failed FOOL like YOU for even impugning my service to begin with! I'm NOT Richard Blumenthal, you know, and I certainly don't believe in stolen valor!
I don't really give a rat's … WHAT you think! If they remove my post, FINE! There are THOUSANDS of places to post, and not ALL of them believe in the censorship you are advocating! You are an F… crybaby who can't stand divergent viewpoints! If you think there are'nt countless MILLIONS of men, women, and veterans who feel the way I do, you're even dumber than your posts indicate! It's not my fault that they choose to let the guys like me who have balls fight their battles, and almost never post in support of me! I have ALL the V.A. phone numbers, dumb ass, and everyone knows the V.A. is'nt responsive to vets! They don't even return your calls! They also illegally punish veterans in numerous ways, including delaying our checks repeatedly if they find out that we're anti-government! If you write and think well enough (and I certainly DO) to make a difference, they punish you even more! Did I even once use the N word, or say anything racist about minorities? Of course not! I just pointed out that counter cultural elements in this country are trying to turn everyone against everyone, by giving pet groups like women, minorities, lesbians, and homosexuals special rights, privileges, and benefits that Caucasian, gentile, and heterosexual males can't get! It does'nt take a genius to know that this is poisoning the well, alienating gentile, Caucasian, and heterosexual males, and turning everyone against everyone! What you call HATE, is TOTALLY justified and righteous anger and indignation! I've been forced to stand by, and see my beautiful country become a toilet bowl that kills the unborn randomly, invades every country with resources it can steal, and a different way of living than WE have, then wonders why the F it's hated, and gets attacked!
Please seek professional help.
You are impaired! These comments are very close to treasonesse in form. I am sure you will not see that to be true as you are obviously blinded by your prejudices. As long as there are people in our world like you, we iwll not be able to sit at a 'Table of Reason' and work things out in a civilized manner. It is too bad that this forum cannot be kept to its true purpose.
This is the way it is: At 60, I now have very poor eyesight, some trouble hearing, and degenerative arthritis which is so severe, that sometimes my knees are three times their normal size! Yet, I'm willing to put my ass on the line again, since our current military and cops are punks and cowards who have NO intention of honoring their sworn oaths to protect their country, flag, people, and Constitution! The so called Oath Keepers are the JOKE of the earth, and a TOTAL government front! I'm not even sure about The Real Oath Keepers! It's a PATHETIC commentary that our country and it's "defenders" have sunk THIS low! We're being eaten alive, and NOBODY cares!
You sissy crybabies who complain to YouTube about me should know one thing!: I CAN'T be stopped! If YouTube does'nt believe in free speech, and deletes my posts, and even my ACCOUNT, I'll just go elsewhere! There are THOUSANDS of search engines and chat rooms, and they are'nt ALL controlled by the government! I'll visit them ALL, AND picket government offices, AND write BOOKS if I HAVE to! I don't want to live in a failed country that invades every country that has natural resources that the U.S. can STEAL, or has a different set of social mores than that believed in by too many Americans! You should ALSO know that when you impugn my war record because you don't like me pointing out the TOTALLY failed foreign policy of this country, you look exactly like the uneducated HICK idiots you ARE!
Rick, if making these posts floats your boat, press on. However, if someone throws out racist slurs and lies, such as about people of Jewish heritage, etc. then they will lose our respect and our ear. We’ve served with all of the great ethnic heritages that make up the US Armed Forces, and to quote Pogo, “they is us.” Thanks
You libs kill me. You speak of tolerance and then call Tea Party,, Tea Baggers.. You libs are the intolearte ones. go screw.